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Steve Myers
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The township is suing Joubran over the size of his roadside advertisements, the first time the township has filed a lawsuit in a sign dispute.
At least one of the signs advertising Pine view Estates is more than three times larger, but Joubran said he’s had signs in the township for 25 years and never had an issue with their size or the local government.
Genesee Township attorney James Dillard said township officials have “had several meetings with Mr. Joubran” to resolve the issue, “but he just spits back in our face.”
Genesee Township Treasurer Thomas Mannor said he’s got an issue with the way things are being handled with Joubran.
“It bothers me as a trustee and treasurer that we only pursue him,” said Mannor. “Others have off-site signs too. If we are going to enforce off-site (signs), we should pursue 100 percent (of them).”
http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2011/03/genesee_township_suing_busines.html
Last edited by Steve Myers on Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:09 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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Sat Mar 05, 2011 11:19 pm |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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| Remember the Busch investigation into Buggsys. There were allegations that Joubran paid off cops and politicians. He also allegedly attempted to pay off a Liquor Control Commissioner with a fur coat in the Mikatam deal. |
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Sun Mar 06, 2011 9:02 am |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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San Diego Reader | Who is the Union-Tribune's new owner?
May 13, 2009 ... Over the years, Busch accused Joubran of a litany of crimes. One case involved a charge of felonious assault brought by Busch against ...
http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2009/may/13/cover/ - 118k - Cached - Similar pages
Except 1
But there is another side of Tom Joubran.
He has endured decades of controversy: In 1980, during testimony before a United States Senate subcommittee, the executive director of the Saginaw Valley Crime Commission listed him as a “person of interest,” purportedly involved in “organized criminal activities” in the Flint, Michigan area.
Further evidence of Joubran’s notoriety is found in a lawsuit that two teenagers in his extended family filed in January 2000 in Flint federal court against Damon McCord, their tenth-grade teacher, and the Kearsley Community School District. Jamil Joseph Joubran and Ryan James Anderson charged that McCord, their English teacher at Kearsley High, had made “false, disparaging and/or defamatory comments” about their great-uncle.
According to the complaint, McCord told his American literature class that “Tom Joubran is a crooked son-of-a-..”; “Tom Joubran rips people off”; “Tom Joubran is an arsonist”; and “Tom Joubran burns down buildings.” McCord denied making the remarks, and in August 2001 the case was dismissed in favor of the defendants, court records show.
(Mccord poved Joubran was slander proof)
excerpt 2
Joubran has long maintained that he was a victim of prejudice against Arabs, as well as a vengeful county prosecutor with his own unsavory ties, an integral part of the rough-and-tumble criminal underworld that thrived in Flint and the surrounding Saginaw Valley.
His nemesis was Genesee County prosecutor Arthur Busch, who grew up in a blue-collar household near Flint and counts among his high school friends Michael Moore, the film director who began his career publishing the Flint Voice, an alternative newspaper.
“As far as I’m concerned, he’s a gangster, and I don’t care if you print it,” Busch, now in private law practice, said of Joubran during a recent telephone interview. Over the years, Busch accused Joubran of a litany of crimes. One case involved a charge of felonious assault brought by Busch against Joubran in 1995. It was described in a November 2003 Michigan Court of Appeals document.
“The charge arose from a complaint that [Joubran] pointed a gun at a highway worker. [Joubran] entered a no contest plea to the charge of attempted felonious assault and was sentenced to a term of three years’ probation, two hundred hours of community service and costs.”
During that case, a former Joubran employee, Wayne Atwell, testified under oath that Joubran had told him he could have Busch and his family killed, according to an August 1995 Flint Journal account. Joubran denied the allegation. In court, Atwell said that he had four felony convictions and had been sent back to jail after Joubran accused him of taking $1700, the article said. Joubran said he was forced to plead nolo contendere to the gun charges because he didn’t want to risk a prison sentence for the three felony counts originally filed against him, according to a January 1996 Flint Journal report. He was sentenced to a term of three years’ probation, 200 hours of community service, and costs, according to Michigan court records.
In an interview last week, Joubran said he pled no contest because he feared he couldn’t get a fair trial in Flint.
“I have never owned a gun in the history of my life, even back with the Jews and the Arabs [in Palestine], I never owned a gun. Never. I had a beeper with me, not a gun. I wasn’t guilty. I never had no gun, ever, ever in the history of my life. I don’t even know how to use it.
“They told me if you go in front of a jury and, you know, people don’t like you, they could put you in prison.
“Oh, yeah, they were jealous of me. They were very jealous of me. They were very jealous, because I came here in 1950, and of what I did, and I’m worth millions of dollars, and my nephews are in the billions of dollars. And we are successful, and it makes people jealous sometimes. But a lot of people love you — you have more people like you than hate you.
“But when you never know. Maybe we evicted somebody from a house or apartment building, they might be on the jury, they may turn against me, and I’m stuck with two years in prison. No way. So they advised me to [plead no contest]. We work hard, we fight like hell to survive, I guess.”
In 2000, Joubran filed suit in Michigan state court against Busch, claiming that Joubran had experienced “emotional distress” as a result of “a pattern of harassment and a false investigation of him” by Busch’s office, according to state appeals court records.
According to the document, Joubran alleged that Busch’s vendetta against him included the “issuance of subpoenas and the questioning of potential witnesses regarding underage drinking at Bugsy’s, possible intentional under-assessment of property taxes, and [repeated investigations of] any relationship between his real property holdings in Genesee Township and drug proceeds.”
“In 1998, Busch and the Michigan Attorney General’s office obtained an investigatory subpoena…for April Parish, a young woman who has worked for [Joubran] for years,” the court records said. “Parish was one of the individuals from whom the prosecutor’s office attempted to obtain information regarding underage drinking at Bugsy’s Bar and Grill, an establishment owned and operated by [Joubran’s] son.”
During Busch’s investigation of Joubran, Parish told authorities that when she was a teenager, she had a sexual relationship with Joubran. She later recanted her testimony, claiming that Busch coerced her to make false statements against Joubran.
“In her deposition taken pursuant to the subpoena, Parish testified to sexual conduct with [Joubran] when she was fifteen years old,” according to the court record. “[Joubran] has submitted an affidavit from Parish in conjunction with the present suit, in which she alleged that a member of the Genesee County Sheriff’s Department approached her at her home and attempted to force her to provide testimony regarding [Joubran].
“Parish further stated that this individual, Sergeant John Fontana, and Busch threatened her with criminal prosecution if she did not give false testimony against [Joubran]. Parish indicated that the testimony she previously provided regarding [Joubran] was coerced by Busch and others acting in his behalf and that she felt she had no alternative but to provide false testimony regarding [Joubran].”
In November 2003, a three-judge panel of the Michigan Court of Appeals dismissed Joubran’s case, in part because, the court held, Busch enjoyed immunity as a prosecutor investigating possible criminal activity: “...it is clear that Busch was exercising his duly authorized, legitimate investigative duties as a prosecuting attorney,” the court concluded. A similar complaint Joubran brought earlier in federal court was also dismissed.
Joubran told the Flint Journal that the ruling gave Busch “a license to steal.”
Busch says that the charges he brought against Joubran were legitimate and backed by the result of extensive investigation. He denies that any witnesses were ever coerced to falsely testify and complains that the FBI and federal prosecutors failed to follow up on leads he had generated, some of them international, that were out of his jurisdiction.
In an interview last week, Joubran expressed deep bitterness about the case and its prosecutor, Busch.
But Joubran said he was reluctant to discuss the matter further because his nephew Tom Gores didn’t want him to rehash the family’s past troubles.
“I don’t have to mention anything about that because my nephew don’t like this kind of stuff, okay? You can’t dredge up Arthur Busch. Leave Arthur Busch out of the picture. We don’t know him, we don’t like him, we don’t want anything to do with him. He’s the nastiest prosecutor we ever had. |
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Sun Mar 06, 2011 9:38 am |
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Steve Myers
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quote:
Steve Myers schreef:
The township is suing Joubran over the size of his roadside advertisements, the first time the township has filed a lawsuit in a sign dispute.
At least one of the signs advertising Pine view Estates is more than three times larger, but Joubran said he’s had signs in the township for 25 years and never had an issue with their size or the local government.
Genesee Township attorney James Dillard said township officials have “had several meetings with Mr. Joubran” to resolve the issue, “but he just spits back in our face.”
Genesee Township Treasurer Thomas Mannor said he’s got an issue with the way things are being handled with Joubran.
“It bothers me as a trustee and treasurer that we only pursue him,” said Mannor. “Others have off-site signs too. If we are going to enforce off-site (signs), we should pursue 100 percent (of them).”
http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2011/03/genesee_township_suing_busines.html
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Steve Myers |
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Sun Mar 06, 2011 10:34 am |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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Perhaps this is a test case and his signs are the worst offenders. Are you defending Joubran? He certainly has gotten away with a lot in the past!
Dillard is an honest attorney with a fine reputation. I am sure this is only the first of a series of cases.
When Shriner was with the Flint Journal, he lost his job for his biased reporting of Joubran and his refusal to stay away from Joubran. |
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Sun Mar 06, 2011 10:52 am |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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(Genesee Township attorney James Dillard said township officials have “had several meetings with Mr. Joubran” to resolve the issue, “but he just spits back in our face.” )
This is Joubran's biggest problem as I see it. He appears to think he is above the law.
Plus there are other stories where Joubran has had trouble with Township officials. Jpubran says he has had other signs in the community, but he does not address the age of this particular sign. Journal should have said how long thsi sign was raised and how long the talks regarding the sign have been going on.
I applaud the Township for addressing the sign issue as an issue of sign pollution. Burton and other communities are dealing with sign issues, particularly the flashing kind. Residents often object to this form of blight. After years of large commercial signs , the State began addressing commercial signs along the highways.
Mannor addresses "off site signs" when the issue is sign size, |
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Sun Mar 06, 2011 11:03 am |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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Journal comments to your thread:
View: Oldest first | Newest first
jacobsmith March 04, 2011 at 10:38AM
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Who owned the Mikatam and served booze to minors?
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Soon To Be Six Three March 04, 2011 at 10:46AM
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What's the problem? Given enough time the signs will mysteriously go up in flames.
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newby March 04, 2011 at 10:57AM
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Dude!!
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melody1964 March 04, 2011 at 12:46PM
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And after the fire, a newer, bigger and better sign will be in its place. Wasn't that how it worked for grocery stores??
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shanedr March 04, 2011 at 11:15AM
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Tom Joubran never did anything for the township, other then to demonstrate how easily it was to violate its ordinances.
Why does a township have to sue for ordinance violations? I though all that was necessary was to fine him and then arrest and haul him into court if he didn't pay the fines. Jail time would do him good even if for only an hour.
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jeremiah45 March 04, 2011 at 12:14PM
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Just a little petty, don't you think?? Mr. Joubran and his family have always been kind and helpful to me, and I'm very grateful. ................. Okay, let the bashing begin!
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melody1964 March 04, 2011 at 12:47PM
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The Township is suing Tom Jourbran. Looks like someone on the Township board will be waking up with the fishes.
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grantblank March 04, 2011 at 1:14PM
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Genesee Twp.officials perhaps should be careful. Is not Joubrans nephew that dude who is about to buy the Pistons and Palace? As a billionare who probably could care less about that backwater Township, he could easily make it a parking lot, or a landfill for the Palace, with of course the execption his uncles businesses. Paybacks, as The City Of Flint has learned, can be hell./
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427435 March 04, 2011 at 11:06PM
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I thought it was called Jourbranville .... when did it get remaned to Genesee?
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ldlsr March 04, 2011 at 11:25PM
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Someone will wake up with a horsehead in their bed for sure. Here comes Tom, look out.
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48506 March 05, 2011 at 7:57AM
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I pay taxes in the township also. It looks like Tom has a township board he can't control like the previous board. Don't be suprised if he retaliates and starts a recall on the board members that don't support his violations. Now lets break this down...he didn't support the current board, and they won...WHERE'S THE RETALIATION? Who would want his support after that? It's about time everybody is treated equal in the township.
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Sun Mar 06, 2011 11:10 am |
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Steve Myers
Site Admin
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You are missing the whole point of the story.
Mr Joubran's past has nothing to do with the way the Township is spending our money. We just laid off 6 officers and now we are suing over signage? Make a lot of sense doesn't it??
If you would have read the story then you would have taken note of what Mr Mannor said " It bothers me as a trustee and treasurer that we only pursue him,” said Mannor. “Others have off-site signs too. If we are going to enforce off-site (signs), we should pursue 100 percent (of them).”
So I ask you, is it Is it fair to use money we don't have to go after one businessman in the township knowing full well their are others in violation of the ordinance?
FYI
Mr. Joubran, weather you like him or not, pays over $800,000.00 dollars a year to the township in taxes, that would be about a third of the budget.
His name is at the top of the list whenever Kearsley or Genesee schools, the Lions Club and others need money. He also donated the money, $250,000.00, to pay for the Genesee High School track.
I am not saying cut him a break or give him special treatment, but be fair and like Mr Mannor said make the other businesses comply with the ordinance as well.
Steve Myers |
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Steve Myers |
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Sun Mar 06, 2011 1:10 pm |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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I still want to know if this is a new sign and Mannor specifies Off site signs and not the issue of the size of the sign. This article is brief and leaves more questions than answers. Dillard says they have raised the issue of the sign. How many times and over what period of time has this issue dragged on?
Are you saying because Joubran contributes and pays a great deal of taxes, he should be exempt from the law as he indicates he should not be bound by the law. His past is important as some of the M-live comments from residents seem to believe he had a too close relationship with prior administrations. The comments from the administration is that he spits in their face when they attempted a resolution before filing the lawsuit.
Also people are becoming more aware of the pollutive effects of these super large signs. There comes a point when the administration must take a stance on this type of behavior. How can they prosecute others before they address this mega sign? I can see lots of screaming.
And yes it does appear that you are requesting that he receives special treatment. I repeat Mr Mannor did not address the issue of the size of the sign only that there are other off site signs. |
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Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:15 pm |
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Steve Myers
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We don't have M-O-N-E-Y to spend and the board is only picking on one violator!
Again and I will make it bold type for you this time:
I am not saying cut him a break or give him special treatment, but be fair and like Mr Mannor said make the other businesses comply with the ordinance as well.
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Sun Mar 06, 2011 2:23 pm |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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YOU HAVE TO START SOMEPLACE AND YOU START WITH THE BIGGEST VIOLATOR! MANNOR SAID NOTHING THAT WAS RELEVANT TO THE ISSUE!
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Sun Mar 06, 2011 3:02 pm |
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Steve Myers
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| Mr Mannor is on the Township Board and his comments are more then relevant. |
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Steve Myers |
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Sun Mar 06, 2011 3:30 pm |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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I just pulled a Circuit Court Appeal case filed by Joubran and Pineview Estates wherein Joubran appealed a decision about the sign by the Genesee Township Zoning Board to refuse his sign vairiance. The case (10-093376 AA-Judge Hayman) had a settlement issue and was completed by the Judge on 9/24/10.
If Joubran refuses to comply with the Judges order, Dillard has no choice but to proceed with a lawsuit against Joubran.
I can't pull the case until tomorrow, but there is enough information to piece together the basis of the case.
There is another case filed on 1/14/11 (11-095245-CZ-Neithercutt) by the township against 38 defendants and Joubran is named at least 3 times as a defendant on multiple properties. |
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Sun Mar 06, 2011 4:53 pm |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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Genesee Township suing businessman over size of advertising signs
Published: Friday, March 04, 2011, 10:32 AM Updated: Friday, March 04, 2011, 10:32 AM
By Roberto Acosta | Flint Journal
GENESEE TOWNSHIP, Michigan — The township is suing a local business owner over the size of his roadside advertisements, the first time the township has filed a lawsuit in a sign dispute.
The township says three signs put up by business owner Tom Joubran are in clear violation of its 40-square-foot limit.
At least one of the signs advertising Pine view Estates is more than three times larger, but Joubran said he’s had signs in the township for 25 years and never had an issue with their size or the local government.
“We did a lot for the township, and now you are suing me,” said Joubran, who claims new township officials are upset with him because he didn’t support them during the 2008 elections. “It’s a shame.”
Genesee Township attorney James Dillard said township officials have “had several meetings with Mr. Joubran” to resolve the issue, “but he just spits back in our face.”
“Mr. Joubran does whatever he feels like he wants to do irrespective of what the law may say or require,” Dillard said.
The case is to be heard March 28 by Circuit Judge Richard B. Yuille.
Two of the signs are on North Genesee Road, and the other is on Coldwater Road. At least two of them measure 144 square feet
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Genesee Township Treasurer Thomas Mannor said he’s got an issue with the way things are being handled with Joubran.
“It bothers me as a trustee and treasurer that we only pursue him,” said Mannor. “Others have off-site signs too. If we are going to enforce off-site (signs), we should pursue 100 percent (of them).”
It’s not the first time Joubran and the township have been at odds over his signs.
Last year, he appealed a zoning board of appeals decision limiting his sign at Genesee and Richfield roads to 40 square feet. Judge Archie Hayman backed the zoning board of appeals in a September 2010 ruling, but the sign has remained in place.
Dillard said this is the first case in which the township has chosen to sue over signage.
“All we want him to do is do what everybody else is required to do,” he said.
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Sun Mar 06, 2011 4:54 pm |
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Steve Myers
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You can copy and paste all the court documents and case files you like.
It won't change the fact that Genesee Township does not have the money to spend taking cases of no monetary value to court. |
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Sun Mar 06, 2011 6:59 pm |
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