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Author    Post   Adam Ford F L I N T O I D quote: twotap schreef: Well apparently Barackos 100% antigun voting record was just a scam much like most of his record. We can rest easy now. Well from what I hear it does appear Obama may live up to his change mantra and just go after ammunition but then again that may change as well and guns without ammunition is like hope and change with no real plan. Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:30 am  Gumby F L I N T O I D Source please Adam. Otherwise I call bullshit. You can't just make up stuff and expect thinking people to believe it. Mon Jan 12, 2009 8:30 am  twotap F L I N T O I D By the sounds of it Gumby like most Baracko supporters voted for him without knowing what he actually stands for. SOOOO lets run old Barackos voting record by you one more time since thats all we have to base whats in the back of his mind, unless of course we are to overlook it and just take you libs word for it. NOT FACT: Barack Obama voted to allow reckless lawsuits designed to bankrupt the firearms industry.1 FACT: Barack Obama wants to re-impose the failed and discredited Clinton Gun Ban.2 FACT: Barack Obama voted to ban almost all rifle ammunition commonly used for hunting and sport shooting.3 FACT: Barack Obama has endorsed a complete ban on handgun ownership.2 FACT: Barack Obama supports local gun bans in Chicago, Washington, D.C., and other cities.4 FACT: Barack Obama voted to uphold local gun bans and the criminal prosecution of people who use firearms in self-defense.5 FACT: Barack Obama supports gun owner licensing and gun registration.6 FACT: Barack Obama refused to sign a friend-of-the-court Brief in support of individual Second Amendment rights in the Heller case. FACT: Barack Obama opposes Right to Carry laws.7 FACT: Barack Obama was a member of the Board of Directors of the Joyce Foundation, the leading source of funds for anti-gun organizations and “research.”8 FACT: Barack Obama supported a proposal to ban gun stores within 5 miles of a school or park, which would eliminate almost every gun store in America.9 FACT: Barack Obama voted not to notify gun owners when the state of Illinois did records searches on them.10 FACT: Barack Obama voted against a measure to lower the Firearms Owners Identification card age minimum from 21 to 18, a measure designed to assist young people in the military.11 FACT: Barack Obama favors a ban on standard capacity magazines.12 FACT: Barack Obama supports mandatory micro-stamping.13 FACT: Barack Obama supports mandatory waiting periods.2 FACT: Barack Obama supports repeal of the Tiahrt Amendment, which prohibits information on gun traces collected by the BATFE from being used in reckless lawsuits against firearm dealers and manufacturers.14 FACT: Barack Obama supports one-gun-a-month sales restrictions.9 FACT: Barack Obama supports a ban on inexpensive handguns.9 FACT: Barack Obama supports a ban on the resale of police issued firearms, even if the money is going to police departments for replacement equipment.9 FACT: Barack Obama supports mandatory firearm training requirements for all gun owners and a ban on gun ownership for persons under the age of 21.9 1. United States Senate, S. 397, vote number 219, July 2, 2005. (http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=109&session=1&vote=00219) 2. Independent Voters of Illinois/Independent Precinct Organization general candidate questionnaire, Sept. 9, 1996. The responses on this survey were described in “Obama had greater role on liberal survey,” Politico, March 31, 20087. (http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0308/9269.html) 3. United States Senate, S. 397, vote number 217, Kennedy amendment July 2, 2005. (http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=109&session=1&vote=00217) 4. David Wright, Ursula Fahy and Sunlen Miller, "Obama: 'Common Sense Regulation' On Gun Owners' Rights," ABC News' "Political Radar" Blog, http://blogs.abcnews.com, 2/15/08. (http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/02/obama-common-se.html) 5. Illinois Senate, March 25, 2004 SB 2165, vote 20. 6. “Fact Check: No News In Obama's Consistent Record.” Obama ’08, December 11, 2007. (http://www.barackobama.com/factcheck/2007/12/11/fact_check_no_news_in_obamas_c.php) 7. “Candidates' gun control positions may figure in Pa. vote,” Pittsburgh Tribune-Review, Wednesday, April 2, 2008, and "Keyes, Obama Are Far Apart On Guns," Chicago Tribune, 9/15/04. (http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/news/s_560181.html) 8. 1998 Joyce Foundation Annual Report, p. 7. (http://www.joycefdn.org/pdf/98_AnnualReport.pdf) 9. “Obama and Gun Control,” The Volokh Conspiracy, taken from the Chicago Defender, Dec. 13, 1999. (http://www.volokh.com/posts/1203389334.shtml) 10. Illinois Senate, May 5, 2002, SB 1936 Con., vote 26. 11. Illinois Senate, March 25, 2003, SB 2163, vote 18. 12. “Clinton, Edwards, Obama on gun control,” Radio Iowa, Sunday, April 22, 2007. (http://learfield.typepad.com/radioiowa/2007/04/clinton_edwards.html) 13. Chicago Tribune blogs, “Barack Obama: NIU Shootings call for action,” February 15, 2008, (http://blogs.trb.com/news/politics/blog/2008/02/barack_obama_comments_on_shoot.html) 14. Barack Obama campaign website: “As president, Barack Obama would repeal the Tiahrt Amendment . . .” (http://www.barackobama.com/issues/urbanpolicy/#crime-and-law-enforcement.) _________________ "If you like your current healthcare you can keep it, Period"!! Barack Hussein Obama--- multiple times. Mon Jan 12, 2009 9:15 am  Gumby F L I N T O I D No two tap I am just not a one issue voter. I don't care about gun issues as I am not a gun owner. I do know that senate voting record can easily be misconstrued because so much BS is tacked onto each bill. I see no problem with the above though, none of the above takes away your right to own guns. Mon Jan 12, 2009 10:20 am  twotap F L I N T O I D WHAT!!!!!!!! FACT: Barack Obama has endorsed a complete ban on handgun ownership.2 FACT: Barack Obama supports local gun bans in Chicago, Washington, D.C., and other cities.4 FACT: Barack Obama opposes Right to Carry laws.7 FACT: Barack Obama refused to sign a friend-of-the-court Brief in support of individual Second Amendment rights in the Heller case. none of the above takes away your right to own guns. You are making a joke again right??? I wonder what would happen if the word abortion was placed in the above votes where guns or right to carry is used. I suppose that wouldnt take away the right to one of those??? Well ok, "misconstrued votes" how about showing us one where his highness suported gunowners rights as he claimed all through his campaign. Ya know what gets me most of the lefties in congress are against private ownership of guns but being the gutless wienies that they are they are afraid to bring up for a vote whats really on their agenda. Cmon Baracko show us how tough you are lets see what ya really think. Do it and see what happens. Gutless prick. _________________ "If you like your current healthcare you can keep it, Period"!! Barack Hussein Obama--- multiple times. Mon Jan 12, 2009 11:42 am  andi03 F L I N T O I D ****FACT: Barack Obama supports local gun bans in Chicago, Washington, D.C., and other cities.4***** Sure he supports it but a Supreme Court ruling granted that gun rights were individual rights within the DC boundaries... Obama cannot overturn that ruling by himself as pres...nor can he change the Constitution to suit his whims...so even though I don't like guns...you and my husband are safe from having them swept out of your cold dead hands. Mon Jan 12, 2009 11:48 am  twotap F L I N T O I D Yup for now but if Baracko gets to appoint a couple of his lefties pals to the supreme court and its brought up again well I wonder what might happen?? I laugh also at the "Im Not a single Issue voter" when a liberal makes that claim Ya right if his highness was in agreement with all the things that turns libs on except that one glaring sticking point "A womans right to an abortion" he would have went down quicker than Barney Frank on an all male cruise ship. _________________ "If you like your current healthcare you can keep it, Period"!! Barack Hussein Obama--- multiple times. Mon Jan 12, 2009 12:06 pm  Gumby F L I N T O I D I said I wasn't a single issue voter. I never said there weren't any who supported Obama. I am personally against abortions but do not think it is my right to tell a women what to do with her body. Plus perhaps you missed the point where I said I supported McCain (anit-choice) back in 2000. First off, no where in the article used as proof of the complete handgun ban does it even mention a hand gun ban, it talks about a questionnaire that a staffer supposedly filled out for him. Second so called fact: so he thinks it should be up to local and state law to determine gun ownership laws. I thought conservatives loved more local control and less imposition from the federal government. I guess that only counts when it benefits you. Third fact: "I am not in favor of concealed weapons," Obama said. "I think that creates a potential atmosphere where more innocent people could (get shot during) altercations." from your article. While you may not agree with him it in no way takes away your right to own a weapon. I too do not like the idea of concealed weapons, I see the way supposed law abiding citizes treat each other on a day to day basis and the idea that someone may be carrying scares the crap out of me. On the last one you didn't provide a source and I know nothing of the Heller case so I won't comment. Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:25 pm  Gumby F L I N T O I D Also I love how the neo-cons love the second amendment and will defend it til the death but see how they treat the 4th quote: The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized. They love the wire tapping done to "protect them from terrorist" even though all it does is spy on citizens. Or how about the 8th quote: Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted. It is ok to torture people according to them if it gets them information. Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:38 pm  Dave Starr F L I N T O I D quote: Gumby schreef: I too do not like the idea of concealed weapons, I see the way supposed law abiding citizes treat each other on a day to day basis and the idea that someone may be carrying scares the crap out of me. You don't believe in protecting yourself or your loved ones? _________________ I used to care, but I take a pill for that now. Pushing buttons sure can be fun. When a lion wants to go somewhere, he doesn’t worry about how many hyenas are in the way. Paddle faster, I hear banjos. Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:03 pm  twotap F L I N T O I D Hey Gumby it matters little if your in favor of folks carrying legally or not. All but a few of the most liberal run states allow it and crime goes down where its allowed. Notice on the map that Barackos homestate strictly denies it yet the city where all his mentors live and where he got his start has one of the most violent crime activitys in the nation. Of course if you have any facts to back up your claims as well as Barackos that their is something to fear about honest law abiding citizens having the means of self protection why lets have a look see. Otherwise you and Baracko are just blowing more liberal smoke. quote: They love the wire tapping done to "protect them from terrorist" even though all it does is spy on citizens. Once again a lib with inside onfo. How the hell do you know thats all it does or did accomplish. You remind me of another flintoid with all the answers who disappered about the same time you showed up. He also knew everything when it comes to what the government did and to who and the end results. You gotta quit getting your news fron Olberman quote: It is ok to torture people according to them if it gets them information. Once again you or olberman or any of the other handwringers have no idea as to how many AMERICAN lives were saved by the information gained from harsh interrogation. One thing is for certain the terrorists have little to fear with folks like Obama and his CIA pick .Panetta in charge. _________________ "If you like your current healthcare you can keep it, Period"!! Barack Hussein Obama--- multiple times. Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:44 pm  Gumby F L I N T O I D Adam, quote: You don't believe in protecting yourself or your loved ones? I do not even know how to respond to your stupidity after that query. You know there are ways to protect your self out side of using a gun? I for one, don't put myself of situations where a gun is needed. I would not want to live with the fact that I took a human life over some material bullshit that I can live without. twotap, Do you have shit in your ears or are you just too very stubborn to read where I state that i am not a lib or a conservative? I am an independant voter who happens to like Obama. I never vote straight ticket and voted for a mixture of republicans and democrats in all of the elections I have ever voted in. I think you would have to be a complete idiot to follow either of the parties. In regards to torture, torture does not extract reliable information . There have been countles studie that show this time and again. Here are a few online articles found in a few minutes by using the google machine. http://jeffstrabone.blogspot.com/2008/02/torture-helps-terrorists-win_14.html http://www.dailycamera.com/news/2008/dec/26/no-wiggle-room-on-torture/ http://www.vanityfair.com/magazine/2008/12/torture200812 quote: Once again you or olberman or any of the other handwringers have no idea as to how many AMERICAN lives were saved by the information gained from harsh interrogation. And you have no way to know if any American lives were save from torture. Stop trying to make it sound all warm and fuzzy by calling it harsh interrogation. Mon Jan 12, 2009 8:01 pm  Dave Starr F L I N T O I D quote: Gumby schreef: Adam, quote: You don't believe in protecting yourself or your loved ones? I do not even know how to respond to your stupidity after that query. You know there are ways to protect your self out side of using a gun? I for one, don't put myself of situations where a gun is needed. I would not want to live with the fact that I took a human life over some material bullshit that I can live without. I'm not talking about material things, I'm talking about our lives. How do you know which situations may escalate into something dangerous? I'd rather have it & never need it than need it & not have it. _________________ I used to care, but I take a pill for that now. Pushing buttons sure can be fun. When a lion wants to go somewhere, he doesn’t worry about how many hyenas are in the way. Paddle faster, I hear banjos. Tue Jan 13, 2009 8:29 am  twotap F L I N T O I D Yup we are up against someone with the uncanny ability to predict the future, clarify the past and tell us with extreme detail what occured in places he has never been. Face it Dave you are stupid im stupid and hes not. _________________ "If you like your current healthcare you can keep it, Period"!! Barack Hussein Obama--- multiple times. Tue Jan 13, 2009 8:31 am  Dave Starr F L I N T O I D ‘‘Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined’’ — Patrick Henry ‘‘The great object is that every man be armed. Everyone who is able may have a gun.’’ — Patrick Henry ‘‘Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.’’ — Jefferson's "Commonplace Book," 1774-1776, quoting from On Crimes and Punishment, by criminologist Cesare Beccaria, 1764 ‘‘No freeman shall be debarred the use of arms (within his own lands or tenements).’’ — Thomas Jefferson: Draft Virginia Constitution (with his note added), 1776. Papers 1:353 ‘‘To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them...’’ — Richard Henry Lee, 1787 ‘‘And that the said Constitution be never construed to authorize Congress to infringe the just liberty of the press, or the rights of conscience; or to prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms; or to raise standing armies, unless necessary for the defense of the United States, or of some one or more of them; or to prevent the people from petitioning, in a peaceable and orderly manner, the federal legislature, for a redress of grievances; or to subject the people to unreasonable searches and seizures of their persons, papers or possessions.’’ — Samuel Adams, Debates of the Massachusetts Convention of 1788 ‘‘[The Constitution preserves] the advantage of being armed which Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation (where) the governments are afraid to trust the people with arms.’’ — James Madison, Federalist, No. 46. ‘‘Are we at last brought to such humiliating and debasing degradation, that we cannot be trusted with arms for our defense? ... If our defense be the real object of having those arms, in whose hands can they be trusted with more propriety, or equal safety to us, as in our own hands?’’ — Patrick Henry ‘‘I ask, sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people, except for a few public officials.’’ ‘‘To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them.’’ — George Mason ‘‘No slave shall keep any arms whatever, nor pass, unless with written orders from his master or employer, or in his company, with arms from one place to another. Arms in possession of a slave contrary to this prohibition shall be forfeited to him who will seize them.’’ — A Bill Concerning Slaves, Virginia Assembly, 1779 ‘‘The world is filled with violence. Because criminals carry guns, we decent law-abiding citizens should also have guns. Otherwise they will win and the decent people will lose.’’ — James Earl Jones, Actor ‘‘The right of self-defense is the first law of nature; in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest possible limits. ... and [when] the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any color or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction.’’ — St. George Tucker, Judge of the Virginia Supreme Court 1803 ‘‘Before a standing army can rule, the people must be disarmed; as they are in almost every kingdom of Europe. The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword; because the whole body of the people are armed, and constitute a force superior to any bands of regular troops that can be, on any pretense, raised in the United States’’ — Noah Webster, 1888 ‘‘Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest.’’ — Mahatma Ghandi, "Gandhi, An Autobiography", page 446 ‘‘In a polity, each citizen is to possess his own arms, which are not supplied or owned by the state.’’ — Aristotle ‘‘Germans who wish to use firearms should join the SS or the SA - ordinary citizens don't need guns, as their having guns doesn't serve the State.’’ — Heinrich Himmler ‘‘We cannot be so fixated on our desire to preserve the rights of ordinary Americans.’’ — B.J.Clinton, USA Today, 3/11/93 page 2A ‘‘The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subjected people to carry arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subjected peoples to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing. Indeed, I would go so far as to say that the underdog is a sine qua non ["something essential" lit. "without which not"] for the overthrow of any sovereignty. So let's not have any native militia or police.’’ -- Adolph Hitler, Edict of March 18, 1938 ‘‘We, the People are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts — not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow men who pervert the Constitution.’’ — Abraham Lincoln ‘‘When we got organized as a country and we wrote a fairly radical Constitution with a radical Bill of Rights, giving a radical amount of individual freedom to Americans ...... And so a lot of people say there's too much personal freedom. When personal freedom's being abused, you have to move to limit it. That's what we did in the announcement I made last weekend on the public housing projects, about how we're going to have weapon sweeps and more things like that to try to make people safer in their communities.’’ — Bill Clinton, 3-22-94 ‘‘ They, the makers of the Constitution: conferred, as against the government, the right to be let alone - the most comprehensive of rights and the right most valued by civilized men.’’ ‘‘Experience should teach us to be most on our guard to protect liberty when the government’s purposes are beneficial ... the greatest dangers to liberty lurk in insidious encroachment by men of zeal, well meaning but without understanding’’ — Supreme Court Justice Louis D. Brandeis, 1928 ‘‘...for it is a truth, which the experience of all ages has attested, that the people are commonly most in danger when the means of insuring their rights are in the possession of those of whom they entertain the least suspicion.’’ — Alexander Hamilton ‘‘A government resting on the minority is an aristocracy, not a Republic, and could not be safe with a numerical and physical force against it, without a standing army, an enslaved press and a disarmed populace.’’ — James Madison, The Federalist Papers (No. 46). ‘‘It is not the function of our government to keep the citizen from falling into error; it is the function of the citizen to keep the government from falling into error.’’ — Justice Robert H. Jackson ‘‘The power of collecting and disbursing money at pleasure is the most dangerous power that can be entrusted to man.’’ — attributed to Horatio Bunce in Sockdolager ‘‘You need only reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence.’’ — Charles A. Beard ‘‘Four out of five politicians surveyed prefer unarmed, ignorant peasants.’’ — Unknown _________________ I used to care, but I take a pill for that now. Pushing buttons sure can be fun. When a lion wants to go somewhere, he doesn’t worry about how many hyenas are in the way. Paddle faster, I hear banjos. Tue Jan 13, 2009 8:57 am    Display posts from previous:   All Posts1 Day7 Days2 Weeks1 Month3 Months6 Months1 Year Oldest FirstNewest First

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