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munnbreslin
F L I N T O I D
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| Just talked with a guy from Mott Park. He says he is glad that police will be on foot because he and his neighbors feel like they are completely detached when they cruise through in their, "fords and chargers." Just saying, this is the sentiment in Flint. I think community policing will be good for the already stable districts (Mott Park, College Cultural, Woodcroft, Circle Drive, Downtown), but it will not benefit the struggling ones as much (North End, State Streets, Between Dort and Center). The nice neighborhoods should benefit because this seems like it will be able to keep little problems little by identifying them early. The struggling neighborhoods will not benefit as much because this program is designed around defusing problems before they start, not dealing with already existing epidemics. Again, we need to give UM-Flint cops and Baker Cops, along with possibly private forces, arrest rights. If the city cannot afford to provide these services as they had, we need to let it be done by others. The safety of the residents needs to come first and this sort of a public-private partnership could be very beneficial. Bossman, tell me what you think of that. |
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Sun Feb 28, 2010 12:12 am |
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munnbreslin
F L I N T O I D
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| (By the way, realized "tell me what you think of that" sounds sarcastic. Not supposed to be, sorry if it came off with a disrespectful tone. Trying to keep a civilized, respectful discourse). |
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Sun Feb 28, 2010 12:14 am |
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Adam
F L I N T O I D
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quote:
Bossman schreef:
Here is some reality. Just today a call came in at around 1030am for a domestic. The woman was calling on her boyfriend breaking out her windows with a hammer. No officers were available to respond. The woman called back at 1230pm to ask for an ETA. The man was still breaking windows. Still no officers available. The woman called back at 315pm and advised that she had shot the suspect with a rifle. Life extinguished because there were no officers available for 5 hours in the middle of the day at current staffing levels.
Any more details on this? Was the woman even charged with anything? |
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Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:13 am |
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Adam
F L I N T O I D
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quote:
munnbreslin schreef:
Just talked with a guy from Mott Park. He says he is glad that police will be on foot because he and his neighbors feel like they are completely detached when they cruise through in their, "fords and chargers." Just saying, this is the sentiment in Flint.
Just wait until he needs to call 911. Then he'll feel really detached. The way I see it Flint police might not even have the man power to scrape the dead bodies off the streets in the north end if we get two shootings at once. |
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Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:20 am |
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munnbreslin
F L I N T O I D
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| Are Bossman and Terry really the only posters on here that can have a civilized discourse. Come on Adam. |
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Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:58 pm |
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Dave Starr
F L I N T O I D
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| Last summer, a lady I know called 911 about some gang bangers shooting at each other on her street. 911 said: "what do you want us to do about it? No officers are available". How much worse will it get when 50 more officers are gone? |
_________________
I used to care, but I take a pill for that now.
Pushing buttons sure can be fun.
When a lion wants to go somewhere, he doesn’t worry about how many hyenas are in the way.
Paddle faster, I hear banjos. |
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Sun Feb 28, 2010 2:02 pm |
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Adam
F L I N T O I D
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quote:
munnbreslin schreef:
Are Bossman and Terry really the only posters on here that can have a civilized discourse. Come on Adam.
In most "civilzed communities" if you call the police they show up. You can worry about b.s. semantics all you want but seriously if you have two shooyings at the same time and only 5 officers on duty tough choices will have to be made.
You act like 9 officers can do that much. Who really cares if you have an officer strolling around your neighborhood. Criminals aren't as dumb as people like you. They could probably just wait until they see the neighborhood officer and then drive a few blocks away and start breaking into houses or just not commit crime when we have those 9 extra officers for the 8 hours a night. |
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Sun Feb 28, 2010 2:10 pm |
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munnbreslin
F L I N T O I D
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Oh Adam, calling people stupid seems to be your go-to move hahah. Lets watch what I can do here. I'll replace neighborhood officers with cruisers. "You act like 9 officers can do that much. Who really cares if you have an officer driving through your neighborhood. Criminals aren't as dumb as people like you. They could probably just wait until they see the car leave and then drive a few blocks away and start breaking into houses or just not commit crime when we have those 9 extra officers for the 8 hours a night."
See how easy it is to have cruisers look worthless. Adam, your logic does not add up. Please find another thread to degrade individuals because you lack the integrity to deal with pure discussions. |
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Sun Feb 28, 2010 2:23 pm |
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Adam
F L I N T O I D
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How's this for logic for ya. Hopefully you can comprehend this. With Dayne eliminateing police I'll have less police presence in my neighborhood and unless I shoot/kill the suspect it's bascially pointless to even call the police. You act like 9 community police officers will make much of a difference. I think we should prioritize 911 calls even though 911 calls will probably be a lost cause.
Here's even simpler. I used to have 2 or 3 officers driving through my neighborhood that a saw a few times a month. If this ward officer walks on foot I'll be lucky if I see him even once a month.
1 officer for 8 hours a day for 8-10,000 residents is not going to be able to do much. If the officer even spent 1 minute a month talking to each resident that would probably keep him busy for 2 or 3 months assuming he didn't take any calls arrest anybody etc. |
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Sun Feb 28, 2010 3:05 pm |
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munnbreslin
F L I N T O I D
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| Wait, so you think it will take 30 days, working 8 hours a day, for an officer to walk every street in 1/9 of the city? Are you kidding me? Lets say a ward has 150 streets. Second shift officers working 8 hours a day will work 240 hours a month total for the community policing grant which runs 7 days a week. If there are 150 streets in the ward, according to your idea, the officer would be "lucky" to average 1.6 HOURS on EACH STREET. My god how slow do you think our officers are? Lets say it takes them 10 minutes to walk one street (some longer some shorter), an average estimate. They would, by this estimate, be able to walk each street 10 times every month (9.6 times exactly), thats about 3 times a week. I'm sorry but I feel much more safe seeing an officer in front of my house 3 times a week than seeing a cruiser fly by going 25 every now and then. And on top of this, community policing is based around neighborhood organizations. If you want to see great examples of these proactive groups, look at the Mott Park Neighborhood Association or the College Cultural Neighborhood Association (albeit they usually call the Mott Police for break-ins, not FPD). Again, 3 times down my street a week is a heck of a lot better than cruising by. I'm not saying these layoffs are good, I wish these community officers had much more backup, but the dollars are not there. We have to totally reorganize the way the department is run, look at the wonders Warren Evans is doing in Detroit with a depleted budget. It can be done, but the department needs reform. |
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Sun Feb 28, 2010 4:29 pm |
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Adam
F L I N T O I D
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| My point is 1 officer policing 8-10,000 people can not do a whole lot. |
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Sun Feb 28, 2010 6:17 pm |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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quote:
munnbreslin schreef:
I wish these community officers had much more backup, but the dollars are not there. We have to totally reorganize the way the department is run, look at the wonders Warren Evans is doing in Detroit with a depleted budget. It can be done, but the department needs reform.
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Munnbreslin- You are not listening. Evans is doing a great job because he knows what he is doing. Our chief was an interim Captain who did not receive the position after being tested. In my opinion he has not displayed any great leadership. He is way behind in his contractual obligation to have assignment changes for the layoffs.
You think this foot patrol thing is new. Other chiefs tried it and variations of it in the last 6 to 7 years. COPS officers were to walk their beats and more than once, they were to ride their special bicycles on their beats. It never worked because the needs of answering and responding to calls were greater than the departments commitment to foot patrol.
One murder can tie up large numbers of officers to secure the scene and gather evidence. Do you think foot patrol will be a priority in that situation.
You said you live in Atlas so they will never walk your neighborhood. A good COPS officer knows his neighborhood and has established contacts so that he or she is always on top of wrongdoing in their assigned areas.
This grant is one that will not succeed because the department will not be able to follow the terms of the grant. That is the reason community policing came to mean things like the CATT team and other speciality unis.
People are not keeping a courteous discourse with you because you are determined to win and not listen to their knowledge about how Flint policing works. You are the one who wants to debate. |
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Mon Mar 01, 2010 1:26 am |
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munnbreslin
F L I N T O I D
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| Bossman, being that you are on the inside, what is the average salary, with benefit dollars worth included, of the typical liutenant, seargent, officer, etc? Please reply quickly. |
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Mon Mar 01, 2010 9:03 pm |
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munnbreslin
F L I N T O I D
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| Bossman, being that you are on the inside, what is the average salary, with benefit dollars worth included, of the typical liutenant, seargent, officer, etc? Please reply quickly. |
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Mon Mar 01, 2010 9:04 pm |
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bluecat1122
F L I N T O I D
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munnbreslin, I apologize this being my first post and all, but your comments and theories are just turning my stomach so much I feel that I must submit my opinion as an officer.
First off, the foot patrol deal is a 100% political stunt to win support from the community while he sticks them in the a** with the cuts. It WILL NOT WORK! In fact, it's a waste. By your own statement "he is glad that police will be on foot because he and his neighbors
feel like
they are completely detached when they cruise through," is a perfect example of why this is a perfect political move by the mayor; he knows the people will "feel" like something positive is happening. It's just like when you go to Meijers, you see those cameras panning the parking lot while you're in checkout making you "feel" safe, yet nobody is monitoring them. Yes, it may deter petty theives that are amateurs, but it doesn't deter the real criminals. The same argument is true for Flint: first time petty theives "may" be detered, but the ones we have problems with regularly will not stop.
And let me ask you this: If I'm the officer working that area and walk up on a fight or some serious deal, what can I do? The answer? Nothing, until back up arrives. I am "eyes and ears" at that point and have to wait. We aren't supermen, it isn't like tv where we chase them off and shoe them away, this is real. We don't enter situations alone, period. So now you'll have an officer waiting for back up and being told "no cars available." And then if the officer decides to get involved anyway against their training, they're putting themselves at significant risk.
See one thing I don't think you understand is that we're in a new era. These criminals don't care as much as they used to. They're much bolder now. They'll honestly cut your throat, shoot you and never think twice about it. It's almost like the conscience of this new era has been erased. I don't know why, but it's different. There's no respect and more and more want to challenge you everyday. You and I, we respect the uniform, police, military, etc. But these cats on the street don't.
But I only wanted to make a point that this fantasy idea of Walling's for foot patrol is a joke. If people want to "feel" safer or get to know officers, then we should set up meetings and such, not go through with ideas like this. In fact, for what it's worth, many officers including myself will refuse to do these foot patrol deals due to safety concerns, depending on where they set them up.
If you're not a cop, and especially a Flint Cop, you have no clue what types of criminals and mentalities we're dealing with out here. These guys don't think about the consequences of their actions, only "how can I get away with this now."
And last, I don't mean any disrespect toward you because I know you're trying to understand, but these are all fantasy hopes and dreams for non-cops; it's great for TV, but not for Flint. |
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Tue Mar 02, 2010 3:30 am |
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