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1pissedoffguy
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| Lock is an idiot then ,more proof that there are other considerations in mind when they appointed this person . Any cop on the street for any period of time would know ( or should know) telling people who called in to complain about them will cause fur to fly (or worse) . I guess Lock wants to make sure cops got job security, because by telling people who made the complaints against them will make repeat visits from the cops into that neighbor necessary. Telling the people who called the cops on them is not needed for legal reasons, it hasn't got to the point where the accused have the right to face their accusers. Ok BAH, what would be the reason for informing the people who callled in the complaint other that the cops wanting to see someone get harrassed? |
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Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:13 pm |
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BAH836
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quote:
Dave Starr schreef:
I was at a meeting where chief Lock was asked about this & he said he could see no problem with identifying callers.
I don't doubt that he said this.
onepissedguy, I believe Dave is an intelligent person and I think he and I are capable of having a conversation without you having to explain everything I say to him. If for some reason Dave is confused, which doesn't seem to be the case, he will ask ME for clarification of what I have said.
Last edited by BAH836 on Tue Dec 01, 2009 8:36 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 8:05 am |
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BAH836
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quote:
1pissedoffguy schreef:
Ok BAH, what would be the reason for informing the people who callled in the complaint other that the cops wanting to see someone get harrassed?
As I said before, I have never done this so I cannot answer the question.
If I had to guess, I would say because the police obviously enjoy watching citizens get "harrassed" because harassment leads to more police calls (job security) and more work for the officer. No No, that can't be it because more calls would mean less time spent at the convenience store and driving aimlessly. I guess we need to find the balance so we can get enough calls to maintain the proper level of harassment while still ensuring enough time at 711.
I hope you have taught your children, if you have any, to never be friendly to the police. These are the exact morals and examples children need. This type of upbringing has definitely helped the City of Flint become the fine upstanding city that you are so proud live in. Oh wait, you said it was a shithole. Maybe we need a couple more generations of people like you to straighten things out. |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 8:30 am |
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1pissedoffguy
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I teach my kids to be wary of all strangers, and nothing is as stange as person wearing a blue ( dark blue for Flint) uniform and who works for the government. I have had far too much expericences dealing with you yutzes to trust you folks. Cops have harrased people I know, they have harrased me. They have made accusations that were proven to be baseless and yet have insited they were right. I have experinenced this myself SEVERAL times with the Flint cops myself, and not yahoo on a posting board is going to tell me that I am delusional . Okay,smartass, how do you justify the stuff that Dave Star gives an account for? I know, you weren't there , you are hearing 3 rd party, yadayada, Guess what BAH , cops often function on the same sort of assumptions (3rd party) that everyone else does. I know what I have experienced and I will not have some 3rd rate flat foot from a sleazy police force second guess me or try explain to me what happened when you have no knowledge of the events that occured . The hallmark for cops here in Flint is their arrogance, I see that fully demonstrated in how you answer things that you have enough arrogance to burn. Arrongance and ignorance are things Flint cops display, not to mention rudeness, flippancy, snottines , all of which would be tolerable if they got results, which they most often don't. I know what I am talking about and the events of my life better than you do , you arrogant snot.
The city is a shithole, I am here because I own a house free and clear, I pay more than enough taxes to actually pay for 3 of you overrated boys in blue here in this city, so sure I will leave , when I want to, I will also raise my kids as I chose to . Funny,now that you mention it, sort of hinting of "family values" ,but most Flint cops I know, male and female , usally are boinking someone else other than their spoused on a fairly regular basis,so I won't be preached to by A.) a public servant and B.) someone who represents a group that has often( not always but often) displayed terrible lapses in moral judgement themselves.
I have ,in fact , told my kids , that if they are approached by police officer to submit to the authority BUT not to engage any in personal information sharing with them UNLESS it is germaine to the reason why the officer states why her or she are stopping, detaining . I have also sat my kids down with the video BUSTED made by Ira Glasser ,formerly of the ACLU, to show how to handle police stops and the questioning that may come up. I also told my kids to activate those digital voice recorders like I adovcate here. I told my kids cops are agents of the government so don't not start confrontations with the cops but try to keep their heads when or if the cops approach them. Let's be honest BAH, cops are not out there to make friends even they are good ones, they are out there to bust people and ,hopefully, to cause the criminally minded not to start something because of the police presence, cops are not in existence to be friends with the public. And from some of the contacts I had with the police, I would say they displayed genuine contempt for the average person, so I , trying to keep their superior position in society like a good citizen is supposed to, and would not want to sully them by being friendly to them, god forbid they be tainted with anything like that!
Long post, got to get in more points. Why do some cops reveal to those they are talking to who the complaint maker is? Like I stated before, this is not the time the person has the right to face their accusers, so why divulge the identity of the callers? I have known several instances where this has occured in, ( of course you would deny it happening at all ,so of course naturally,you being the august representative of the the government that you are , I tremble at stating this) ,but even given my hesitation to engage in debate with a person such as yourself, I did see this happen several times. What purpose would telling the person who it was who made the complaint? Only reason why I call think of is to put pressure on the complaint maker and force them to have to deal with the person they made the complaint about so the "overworked" cops won't have to deal with it. In other words the cops want the complaint maker to be intimidated by the person they had made a call about, probably to ensure the complaint maker won't call the cops back anymore. Nice approach there BAH, let the complaint maker now face the clear prospect of becoming a vicitm, really nice of you cops to do this.
So , sure , I taught my kids to look at cops as an obstacle or at least an annyoance, for that is what the adversial system we have essentially boils it down to. I will leave quote from Jack Handy " I think the mistake many of us a make is thinking that the state appointed psychiatrist is our friend" , that is what I want my kids NOT assume with the cops. And be honest BAH, if you can, cops look at the general public as an annyoance or an obstacle that has to be dealt with as well. |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 4:19 pm |
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BAH836
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I really don't think you are even reading my responses to the questions asked of me. If you are; you are clearly reading selectively. I have answered the question reference telling someone who called the police on more than one occasion. I have not also forgot the fact that you consistently refuse to answer questions I have asked of you.
Also, I will probably refrain from anymore discussion with you until you are able to form posts which include paragraphs with proper sentence structure. I do not have the time to re-read your long winded drivel three times to figure out what you are trying to say.
It has always been said that a good argument can be ruined by poor presentation. You ruin any good argument you may have, assuming you even have an argument, because you fail to convey it clearly.
Example:
"And from some of the contacts I had with the police, I would say they displayed genuine contempt for the average person, so I , trying to keep their superior position in society like a good citizen is supposed to, and would not want to sully them by being friendly to them, god forbid they be tainted with anything like that!" |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 4:59 pm |
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Domet
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| Oh BAH836 - even though we have disagreed in the past (civilly), I have a deep appreciation for both your attitude and ability to frame arguments/debate. |
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Lack of support for your assertions does not make you a sage, it just makes the rest of us doubt your reasoning skills. - Elias12, Flint Talk Poster |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 6:21 pm |
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1pissedoffguy
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BAH and Domet, wow! What strange alliances which do occur in life. Domet is a little ACORN puke who wants the country to be a communist state, and BAH , a cop, who will do anything for someone who gives them a paycheck. You said YOU don't give out the information to the people when you talk to them BAH, you never explained the rationale behind your fellow cops doing this. You and Domet are arrogant snots who try to diffuse the issues by calling anyone who disagrees with you "stupid" , which I know I am not. God, how can you and Domet get through normal sized doors with heads pumped up as big your seem to be ?
Oh, I will make this easy for you BAH, I just made fun of you. |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:30 pm |
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1pissedoffguy
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| I just reread my last post. I realized that I have situations in my head that I can not fully talk about because I still have people who I am trying to protect because quite a bit of the the stuff they told me would still come back to them and they would face the consequences. BAH, you may not be the officer involved , you ,perhaps , may not even condone what these cops I am thinking about did. It frustrates me to hell that I can not give out all details because I really do think these situations do deserve to be brought to light. Perhaps some day I can give out all the details here, I really do think many people would be shocked and really angry over it. So BAH, I do have to give you the benefit of the doubt , and in turn, the rest of the cops here in Flint one as well. I have went over and over it in my head and there is no way I can talk about this stuff and not give out information that may cause some good people some harm . It has dawned on me that while my anger has justifiable origins, not all the cops here in Flint perhaps would be willing to go along with what these cops did. I just wish I could lay the whole thing out without causing harm to good people, but there is no way I can, and this really ticks me off. I would really want to see these individuals have to face the music, and if Flint does have good cops ,perhaps they would like to see these people have to take their punishment . I am not one who softens easily , but I have been very unfair, sorry BAH. |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 8:06 pm |
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Domet
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I don't recall calling you stupid, pissed. I remember distinctly pointing out that you are ignorant, and if you want to talk about arrogance let's chat about the arrogance of ignorance. The fact that you believe that a lack of knowledge somehow justifies your positions is incredibly arrogant - further, name calling doesn't make your points, it just justifies my claim regarding your person.
Frankly, you don't soften at all. You lash out at everybody, even though I have at times agreed with you and tried to treat you on more than one occasion with respect. You take things too personally and choose to place me into categories in order to rationalize your unfounded hatred of my person. BAH and I aren't allies - I respect him because he is normally a civil person who knows how to formulate a logical argument. I respect him because, in stark contrast to you, he is willing to have a conversation about something before castigating somebody as a "puke."
I respect this man because he is willing to, in my experience, explore topics and talk about things. On the battlefield, whether friend or foe in position, I can respect him because he doesn't lash out and call me names to justify some ignorant position. His positions are pretty well reasoned, something I can sincerely enjoy in any person of any background.
Civility is met with civility. Live by the sword die by the sword. When you learn to grow up and stop being such a disrespectful, bitter person, you will find me willing to treat you like an adult. Until then, you will be treated as the petulant child you seem to represent. |
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Lack of support for your assertions does not make you a sage, it just makes the rest of us doubt your reasoning skills. - Elias12, Flint Talk Poster |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 8:13 pm |
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1pissedoffguy
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| Domet, sorry but you do lord over people all the time. You are so convinced of your intellect that you mock all others who see things differently than you do. You are an eltist like Obama and the leaders of ACORN. You get angry when someone who calls you on what you represent and try to talk down to them . I suspect you just got out of college, hurrah! But not all lessons in life are taught in college. You try to come across as some person who cares about the poor and alleged downtrodden but I suspect if you ever met with anyone actually fitting that bill you would recoil in revulsion . You are a lot like the Communists leaders were, self appointed spokesman for the under class but aren't from their ranks , your identification with them is superfical and an insult to them.And if you think I am unreasonable and the respect you claim to have for others is riddled with contempt. Your labeling me as "ignorant" can be turned back on yourself, you are ignorant of much . You, simply put , are a snob and I suspect someone merely dabbling in social reform. The world can and will go on without your efforts to 'reform" it . I know the sources of information you draw from in many ways, I just vehemently disagree with your conclusions. That does not make me "ignorant" , it just shows you are frustrated with me not agreeing with you. We all get frustrated Domet, trust me, that is why I am pissed off . I just think you come across as some arrogant college graduate who thinks the world should be in awe of the piece of paper you hang on a wall. I am not in awe, but I am about to run out of toilet paper and am eyeing that paper on the wall. |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:48 pm |
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Domet
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Well, Pissed, despite some of your particular statements, that came off largely as reasonable.
As far as labeling me ignorant - have at it. I have never claimed to not be ignorant of many things - I have never claimed to know all things and I do not pretend that I do. The difference between people I identify as ignorant and those who I do not is not a matter of agreement, and never has been. The difference is one of exploration. When I find myself confronted by something I am ignorant of, my first impulse is to study it and attempt to gain some level of understanding. That is the only reason I expect several things from people - reason or logic and sources of information. I don't have any interest in talking to somebody who cannot explain their positions but would rather yell and scream - how is anybody supposed to understand anything in that situation?
As far as elitism is concerned - I have yet to see you actually prove or reason why I am somehow an elitist. I have said to twotap several times, and to you at least once that I remember, to explain your positions so that I can understand them. Because you choose instead to attack and bully me does not make me an elitist, the blame falls on your shoulders. Am I expected to sit in my chair and constantly ask you nicely for things you are not willing to provide while being bullied and attacked? I don't think that you would stand for that, and you certainly shouldn't expect me to. I don't try to talk down to anybody - I am civil with every person I encounter on this board until they display that my civility will not be met in kind. Then, yes, absolutely - I resort to the same tactics that you and twotap have with me - attacks on the things you seem to be insecure about. Turn about is fair play, yes?
You consistently try to link me to being a self-appointed something, and that characterization is misleading and inaccurate. I have no interest in leading people, and I certainly don't have any interest speaking for them. Any position of leadership I have ever taken up has been foisted upon me. As far as your claims concerning the poor - again unfounded. I have been all over this city, riding my bike from the city center to the north side, talking to and interviewing people from all walks of life. I pick people up on the side of the street who look like they could use a ride, including the one legged man drooling and smelling of liquor who was standing in the middle of court street as cars flew past him honking their horns. I don't brag to my friends or family about these experiences - I don't do these things to gain respect for "helping" people. I use these experiences as a moment to interview whoever is in my car in an attempt to understand their circumstances. Simply put, I am a curious person who finds people of all walks of life to be a curiosity. I do not claim to do this entirely out of the goodness of my heart - it is a reciprocal relationship. I learn something about somebody and they get a ride home or to the bus stop or to the liquor store.
Though you chose to insult my education, I will tell you that I do not make entirely too much of it. As I have said to many people on this board, I do not consider my degree as something that separates me from anybody else. I have always thought that everybody's experiences were relevant and important to know. Even though twotap had been deriding me, I was indeed very interested in his experiences as a GM worker - I do not think that blue collar workers are any less important than anybody holding a BA.
The only contempt I hold for anybody is that for people who have the ability to learn but choose not to. Human experience is a constant learning curve, and to ignore understanding for the sake of political ideology, religious preferences or personal opinions is ignorant and deserving of nothing but contempt. I especially hold in contempt those who warp knowledge for their own ends, attempting to justify their positions by selectively quoting or refusing to actually explore a topic. If I do not understand something, I do not talk about it or post on it until I have done enough research to have a grasp. When I am wrong, and you can present me with the data which shows that I am wrong, I attempt to adjust my view to incorporate new data. This isn't always the easiest process - people do not like to be wrong, and I am no exception. However, whether it is immediately or a couple of days later, I will think about it and look into the matter more deeply until either I can prove the other person correct or find data which capably argues against their position.
As I have said to you many times, Pissed, I do not think you are an idiot and I do not think you are a fool. You are incredibly hostile and, instead of having a conversation, you choose to attack. My labeling of you as ignorant is because you are, in fact, ignorant, and you often choose to remain so which, yes, I find incredibly offensive. Where is your data? Where are your facts? Like my signature basically says - unsubstantiated positions are mere speculation or opinion, they do not represent facts. When presented with facts, you often choose to ignore them and instead attack me personally, which is completely unnecessary. If you think that I am wrong, I am always open to your position and willing to hear why you think I am wrong. Unfortunately, telling me I am wrong and then calling me names does not vindicate your position nor make you seem reasonable in the least.
Yeah - this is a long ass post and it is targeted directly at you. This isn't because I want to explain myself to you and ask for your forgiveness - as far as I am concerned I have done nothing that would require forgiveness. You are, in fact, the offensive person here, and have been since you came out attacking me the first time I met you for completely unwarranted reasons. You judge and you attack, and your arrogance shows in your belief that somehow you are correct in your positions and judgments. I may come off as arrogant because I use big words and write complete sentences with few spelling errors - you and twotap are the real arrogant people here, holding that your opinions are more powerful and relevant than the facts I have presented you with. If you disagree, disagree. There is no need to do it angrily in an attempt to low-blow me on the way out. Your vehement disagreement has a source, and I am legitimately curious as to what it is. If you can explain that without deriding me, then you will find that I will respond to you without derision myself.
I have no interest in making you happy or sad or angry or glad. You are a person, and I try to respect all people. When I am disrespected, I will be as big of a dick as you are. Unfortunately, this is a circular process... but I have no interest in being the "bigger man" and apologizing. The source of my ire towards you is you and your unfortunately framed posts, and I am willing to fight you to the bitter end because you have displayed an inability to reason or to even have a civil conversation. Some might ask, "What's the point?" I will not let ignorance stand on its own regardless of the source - liberal or conservative, blue collar or college educated. I can do it in a civil, friendly way in which conversation is possible or one in which a circular fight ensues in which none can actually be the victor. The end result is, regardless of what you have called me, I have presented information and data which hopefully will result in somebody not being fooled by misleading statements or general falsehoods.
I have tried to engage you more times than I tried to engage twotap, and the only reason I want to engage you is because I sometimes read your posts and realize that under all the bitterness and vitriol, there is a reasonable and interesting person there. Twotap doesn't even bother to engage, and never has - everything out of him is an attack on anybody who disagrees with him. I do not always see that from you. This post is, by my intent, an attempt to convince you that I am not the enemy you have made me out to be. I don't even understand how you came to these conclusions about me, or where your bitterness towards me originates. If you would like to continue to bully and yell and scream, I am fine with that, it's your choice. You should not expect me to treat you as an equal or as anybody deserving respect - I will mock you and point out your failings because that is precisely how you have treated me since our first engagement. As I said above - if you want to act like a petulant child, why should I treat you as an adult on an equal level with me? I come off as arrogant to you because your responses and bullying merits nothing less than considering you to be in a lower position. Rise above, and I will always do the same. |
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Lack of support for your assertions does not make you a sage, it just makes the rest of us doubt your reasoning skills. - Elias12, Flint Talk Poster |
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Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:59 pm |
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twotap
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Bandwidth alert  Hey pissed were gonna have to disagree here as its impossible for me to put bah686 and domet aka little acorn in the same catagory. One is a man who puts his life on the line everyday and deals with the scum of society then goes home at night and puts the days events on the backburner while enjoying his family. The other is a liberal professor brainwashed community agitator elitist who thinks he has all the answers but in reality has not lived long enough or had real life experiences to condone that all seeing all knowing attitude he flaunts in his long winded posts. I rally enjoy posting things I know are outrageous just to get him to unwind and the funny part is he falls for it everytime and even has followers on this forum who swoon over his every word. He reminds me a lot of our current POTUS who has that same longwinded ability to win over the easily swayed although thats been less effective the more the folks see him for the empty suit he is. And of course while Little acorn continues to lable us as "Ignorant" because we dont play by
his
rules (you sometimes get the impression he believes its his forum) hey Fstar you listening  I got news for him that im not changing to meet his criteria of whats fair play on this forum and ill bet you arent either.  |
_________________
"If you like your current healthcare you can keep it, Period"!!
Barack Hussein Obama--- multiple times. |
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Wed Dec 02, 2009 8:58 am |
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1pissedoffguy
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| Twotap, I typically agree with you , but when it comes to cops I have to differ. The cops I ran into Flint ( and this is in only in Flint, I have never had too many run ins with other cops) has lead to me to conclusion that we got short changed when it comes to the cops we have here. I do think Domet , typical of most libs, thinks he is smarter and better educated than anyone and everyone. He says he only resorts to name calling as the last resort. But if he had someone read his postings who was honest and fair, I think they would point out to him his postings are written with huge amounts of condescending assumptions. Domet thinks his role is "educate" people , that other are always in error and he and only he ( or others who totally agree with him) are right. He and liberals like him always want the already over burdened working people to give up more of their resources and help others. Of course the majorettes in ACORN are well compesnated , they have taken care of themselves. |
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Wed Dec 02, 2009 1:01 pm |
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Domet
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twotap, I have no idea what you're raving about here. I had nothing to say with relation to this thread, to be honest. I just wanted to engage Pissed. As for playing by "my" rules - hey, if you don't want to have a logical, fact based conversation, that's fine. However, you shouldn't get upset when I call you on being an ideologue without a shred of evidence supporting your positions. They aren't my rules - they are the normative functions of conversations. If you don't speak a language others can understand, then you are just having a conversation with yourself. This is typically what you do, and you have yet to prove your arguments are anything but conservative talking points backed up with rhetoric. When you can move on to being acting like an adult, I will treat you like one.
As for you pissed - hey, I tried. I didn't think it would get through to you. Like I have said elsewhere - you clearly have an anxiety with regards to education which makes you paranoid around people you think are more intelligent than you. An inferiority complex would nicely and conveniently explain your delusional claiming that I want to "educate" people. I want to inform people - those people can take that information and do what they please with it. If they come back to me and are still wrong, I will continue to point out that they are incorrect until either I can say nothing more on the topic or it becomes so abstracted that conversation is pointless. Your recent round of accusations and inflammatory statements regarding my education and my past history as an unpaid volunteer with ACORN only reinforces my positions about your complex and furthers my points that you should be treated like the child you act out as.
Good day sirs! This thread can now resume it's normal functions. |
_________________
Lack of support for your assertions does not make you a sage, it just makes the rest of us doubt your reasoning skills. - Elias12, Flint Talk Poster |
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Wed Dec 02, 2009 3:42 pm |
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twotap
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| And there you have it folks. Thanks little acorn for once again confirming what we know. see pissed I told ya. Jeez maybe they should change the name of this forum to the little acorn hour. |
_________________
"If you like your current healthcare you can keep it, Period"!!
Barack Hussein Obama--- multiple times. |
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Wed Dec 02, 2009 6:47 pm |
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